more tricks #4866

serprex · 2025-01-12T15:44:42Z

big poe without epona (intermediate)
king dodongo with chu (advanced)
morpha without hookshot (extreme)
underwater chests (novice, glitch)
MQ DC stairs without stick (novice)

Build Artifacts

serprex · 2025-01-12T21:58:46Z

I've added a 5th trick in a separate commit: opening underwater chests (novice, glitch)

Only using it for logic with forest temple well because I'm not confident with water temple logic

soh/soh/Enhancements/randomizer/location_access/dungeons/water_temple.cpp

soh/soh/Enhancements/randomizer/location_access/dungeons/gerudo_training_ground.cpp

soh/soh/Enhancements/randomizer/settings.cpp

soh/soh/Enhancements/randomizer/location_access/dungeons/water_temple.cpp

Pepe20129 · 2025-01-13T21:41:38Z

soh/soh/Enhancements/randomizer/settings.cpp

@@ -351,11 +351,13 @@ void Settings::CreateOptions() {
    mTrickOptions[RT_HOVER_BOOST_SIMPLE] = TrickOption::LogicTrick(RCQUEST_BOTH, RA_NONE, {Tricks::Tag::ADVANCED, Tricks::Tag::EXPERIMENTAL}, "Simple hover boosts", "Allows equipping of hover boots when link is moving at high speeds to extend distance covered. Can be combined with \"Simple damage boosts\" for greater uses.");
    mTrickOptions[RT_BOMBCHU_BEEHIVES] = TrickOption::LogicTrick(RCQUEST_BOTH, RA_NONE, {Tricks::Tag::NOVICE}, "Bombchu Beehives", "Allows exploding beehives with bombchus.");
    mTrickOptions[RT_BLUE_FIRE_MUD_WALLS] = TrickOption::LogicTrick(RCQUEST_BOTH, RA_NONE, {Tricks::Tag::NOVICE}, "Break Mud Walls with Blue Fire", "Use Blue Fire to break mud walls.");
+    mTrickOptions[RT_OPEN_UNDERWATER_CHEST] = TrickOption::LogicTrick(RCQUEST_BOTH, RA_NONE, {Tricks::Tag::NOVICE, Tricks::Tag::GLITCH}, "Open Underwater Chests", "Underwater chests can be opened by wearing iron boots and hookshotting the chest.");


Idk how we're feeling on using the glitch tag already, if we're gonna be using it, we should probably enable filtering by it in the tricks selection and rename glitchless logic.

It's already been added for damage boosts

damage boosts arent generally considered as glitches by the speedrunning community (which i think is the best basis to use since they have a very defined and recognised set of rules)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ebZ94KGlVw gets into having to split glitchless into restricted & unrestricted. I bring up this video in particular because at 12:20 they mention underwater chests, & how that trick will be allowed in the unrestricted category & banned in the restricted category

For rando it seems fair to say glitchless falls under the unrestricted category, in which case this trick should not have the glitch tag

I do think a PR should be made which hides glitch tricks by default if it isn't too hairy

Pepe20129 · 2025-01-13T21:42:49Z

soh/soh/Enhancements/randomizer/settings.cpp

@@ -478,6 +481,7 @@ void Settings::CreateOptions() {
    mTrickOptions[RT_WATER_CHILD_DRAGON] = TrickOption::LogicTrick(RCQUEST_VANILLA, RA_WATER_TEMPLE, {Tricks::Tag::ADVANCED}, "Water Temple Dragon Statue Switch from Above the Water as Child", "It is possible for child to hit the switch from dry land using one of Bombchus, Slingshot or Boomerang. Then, to get to the chest, child can dive through the tunnel using at least the Silver Scale. The timing and positioning of this dive needs to be perfect to actually make it under the gate, and it all needs to be done very quickly to be able to get through before the gate closes. Be sure to enable \"Water Temple Dragon Statue Switch from Above the Water as Adult\" for adult's variant of this trick.");
    mTrickOptions[RT_WATER_MQ_CENTRAL_PILLAR] = TrickOption::LogicTrick(RCQUEST_MQ, RA_WATER_TEMPLE, {Tricks::Tag::NOVICE}, "Water Temple MQ Central Pillar with Fire Arrows", "Slanted torches have misleading hitboxes. Whenever you see a slanted torch jutting out of the wall, you can expect most or all of its hitbox is actually on the other side that wall. This can make slanted torches very finicky to light when using arrows. The torches in the central pillar of MQ Water Temple are a particularly egregious example. Logic normally expects Din's Fire and Song of Time.");
    mTrickOptions[RT_WATER_MQ_LOCKED_GS] = TrickOption::LogicTrick(RCQUEST_MQ, RA_WATER_TEMPLE, {Tricks::Tag::NOVICE}, "Water Temple MQ North Basement GS without Small Key", "There is an invisible Hookshot target that can be used to get over the gate that blocks you from going to this Skulltula early, skipping a small key as well as needing Hovers or Scarecrow to reach the locked door.");
+    mTrickOptions[RT_WATER_MORPHA_WITHOUT_HOOKSHOT] = TrickOption::LogicTrick(RCQUEST_BOTH, RA_WATER_TEMPLE, {Tricks::Tag::EXTREME}, "Water Temple Morpha without Hookshot", "It is possible to slash at Morpha without hookshot.");


Idk if this deserves an extreme rating as for now only pot jump has it, maybe expert would be better but I would like more opinions on this.

Going to remove magic requirement on kokiri sword, since this shows how to clear without

Only pot jump having this tag isn't really a good argument not to use the tag. How many other tricks do you think would fit extreme tag before hookshotless morpha as child link without shield?

While I am wary of trick bloat, if different levels of gear for a trick have enough impact to move the trick up 1 or more tiers, it may be justification for splitting the trick into different versions. I can see "Hookshotless Morpha with good sword" and "Hookshotless Morpha with bad weapons" existing separately.

Also add "morpha with only hammer (no crouch stab)"

But I think we're best keeping this to one trick, expert may be the right difficulty. At least these more difficult situations involve turning on more shuffle options (shuffle sword, adult bosses as child) which if someone is turning on those options & this option they're kinda asking for it (description could even warn about these scenarios)

@A-Green-Spoon has confirmed morpha with only megaton hammer side swings works

Asked @A-Green-Spoon what they thought of difficulty levels here, got a "Difficulty levels all look good to me, ..."

1. big poe without epona 2. king dodongo with chu 3. morpha without hookshot 4. gtg underwater without hookshot 5. open underwater chests (ignore water temple usage for now because water logic is weird) 6. DC MQ stairs without stick, also bring over vanilla alternatives for stairs

serprex · 2025-02-25T13:36:30Z

rebased, PR size halved after #5000 merged

soh/soh/Enhancements/randomizer/location_access/dungeons/gerudo_training_ground.cpp

serprex force-pushed the trick-big-no-epona branch 2 times, most recently from 053ba34 to 5033926 Compare January 12, 2025 17:07

serprex changed the title ~~4 more tricks~~ more tricks Jan 12, 2025

serprex commented Jan 12, 2025

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soh/soh/Enhancements/randomizer/location_access/dungeons/water_temple.cpp Outdated Show resolved Hide resolved

serprex force-pushed the trick-big-no-epona branch from b05f319 to 7e2d380 Compare January 12, 2025 22:31

Pepper0ni suggested changes Jan 13, 2025

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Pepe20129 reviewed Jan 13, 2025

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serprex force-pushed the trick-big-no-epona branch from 7e2d380 to 9336e51 Compare January 14, 2025 00:41

serprex mentioned this pull request Jan 19, 2025

mOptionGroups: populate RSG_TRICKS with loop #4909

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serprex force-pushed the trick-big-no-epona branch from 9336e51 to e84c944 Compare January 19, 2025 20:50

serprex force-pushed the trick-big-no-epona branch from e84c944 to 75d7663 Compare January 31, 2025 02:48

serprex mentioned this pull request Feb 5, 2025

Move boss kill logic into CanKillEnemy #5000

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serprex force-pushed the trick-big-no-epona branch 2 times, most recently from 6e97b2d to 9528578 Compare February 13, 2025 03:50

serprex force-pushed the trick-big-no-epona branch 3 times, most recently from b31844d to 37ffb21 Compare February 18, 2025 04:53

serprex force-pushed the trick-big-no-epona branch from 37ffb21 to 371b7cf Compare February 25, 2025 13:28

serprex force-pushed the trick-big-no-epona branch from 371b7cf to 852bb4f Compare February 25, 2025 13:33

A-Green-Spoon reviewed Feb 25, 2025

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soh/soh/Enhancements/randomizer/location_access/dungeons/gerudo_training_ground.cpp Outdated Show resolved Hide resolved

remove RT_GTG_UNDERWATER_WITHOUT_HOOKSHOT

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serprex requested a review from Pepper0ni March 4, 2025 23:05

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more tricks #4866

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more tricks #4866

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